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darkprime
Senior Member Member
195 Posts |
 Posted - 12/12/2006 : 08:13:38
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| Just a thought, but the top three most congested traffic regions in the country: LA, San Fran, and DC, all have some sort of hybrid exemptions for their HOV lanes. |
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Luddite
Senior Member Member
111 Posts |
Posted - 12/12/2006 : 09:17:36
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| Hybrids Killed HOV. |
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NoSUV
Advanced Member
1076 Posts |
Posted - 12/12/2006 : 09:30:28
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| Just another thought - LA and San Fran are huge compared with DC. Why is DC in the same category? Could it be the slug system that causes the DC problem? After all, it seems logical that mass transit would ease congestion. Isn't that how slugs got their name? From cheating the mass transit system? |
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N_or_S_bound
Advanced Member
649 Posts |
Posted - 12/12/2006 : 09:30:31
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By very definition, SOVs in HOV have replaced the H with an S, ergo HOV no longer exists. Simple substitution.
NoSb
SOV because you can, HOV because you care! |
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Bob
Moderator
781 Posts |
Posted - 12/12/2006 : 10:45:10
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| What percentage of the days would you say that the regular lanes on the 395 part are actually moving faster than the HOVs on average from Springfield? I say 50-70 percent. Mostly because of hybrids. Overall, the total hov system is still much faster because of the Occoquan, but the northern part is getting seriously congested, especially in midweek. |
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darkprime
Senior Member Member
195 Posts |
Posted - 12/12/2006 : 11:20:08
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| Just this morning the main lanes traveled at the same pace or faster between Lorton and Crystal City (6:50-7:25). The same thing has been happening more and more. I was reading an article on the washingtonpost.com from a year ago in which it said the HOV lanes were operating with 400-500 more cars per lane per hour than rated for. Fast forward another year and I beleive that number has grown tremendously. As for Buses to move all these people, where are they? There's extremely few buses that exist to pick up people between Fredericksburg and Woodbridge. |
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NoSUV
Advanced Member
1076 Posts |
Posted - 12/12/2006 : 13:33:11
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I can only speak to I395. For the majority of the trip both ways, express lanes move faster than the regular. For regular, the backups from Edsall to around Exit 5 have vehicles moving an AVERAGE (not maximum) of about 15-20 mph. On the express lanes, I've lately noticed slowdowns at the merge from both Seminary and Shirlington - which I attribute to buses. Despite the slowdown, I AVERAGE the speed limit until the Pentagon back up.
For the return trip, it is rare that the express lanes travel slower than the speed limit; i.e., the MINIMUM is the speed limit. On the regular lanes, however, they NEVER get to the speed limit, and have a tremendous back up around exit 4 when they lose a lane.
I travel in the am from 6:30 to 7: 30 depending on work schedule, and I leave the office during all times for the express lane restrictions.
The answer to your question, Bob, is for the overall length of I395, the regular lanes NEVER travel faster than the express lanes. Perhaps you can get one of the drivers to travel the regular lanes with you and keep in cell phone contact with someone being picked up at the same time who travels in the express lanes and check for yourself. You will clearly see that the express lanes travel faster then the regular lanes 100% of the time over the length of the interstate. |
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CatHerder
New Member
22 Posts |
Posted - 12/12/2006 : 14:07:36
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| I figure this is a taste of things to come with the toll road. As for congestion around Springfield, I think it comes from people still moving onto the HOV to bypass the interchange, plus the increase in the number of cars overall. |
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SpongeBob
Advanced Member
USA
679 Posts |
Posted - 12/13/2006 : 11:46:22
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This is all meaningless personalized speculation unsupported by data. We do not have a complete traffic study of the lanes showing how many vehicles of what kinds at what speeds at what times coming from and going to where.
You'd think the toll road investors would want that data, but they didn't ask for it for the Beltway toll road project. They used a simple traffic projection and overlaid guesses from other toll roads in other parts of the country.
So who knows what causes the morning backups --- it could be...
Excess and/or increased number of vehicles?
Poor ramp design?
Too few exits?
Too many entrances?
Weather?
Time of year?
Pentagon or Federal work shift policies?
The fact that the commuter lots all fill at the same time so everyone leaves at the same time, regardless of their work schedule?
We don't know the answers to these questions, presenting another perfect opportunity for the Sponge to wax eloquent!  |
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n/a
deleted
632 Posts |
Posted - 01/05/2007 : 15:47:20
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| Choke points! Many thousands of commuters coming from suburban VA (and MD), converge on DC via four or five bridge access points each morning, and exit the city the same way each night. Sponge has indicated several problems with the area's highway design, all aggrivate congestion at these choke points. |
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Luddite
Senior Member Member
111 Posts |
Posted - 01/06/2007 : 20:44:56
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| But the water is so pretty. |
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n/a
deleted
632 Posts |
Posted - 02/06/2007 : 14:32:27
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Another interesting discussion that deserves to be bumped up above all the spam.
A little help from the site admin; there seems to be lots of junk messages lately. |
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sluDgE
Moderator
1563 Posts |
Posted - 02/06/2007 : 19:39:20
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raymond,
Someone may view those postings as "offers just too good to pass up"! 
But, for the life of me, I can't figure out who.  |
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tangelo53
Average Member
69 Posts |
Posted - 04/11/2007 : 16:10:17
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quote:
[i]Originally posted by NoSUV[/i]
[br]Just another thought - LA and San Fran are huge compared with DC. Why is DC in the same category? Could it be the slug system that causes the DC problem? After all, it seems logical that mass transit would ease congestion. Isn't that how slugs got their name? From cheating the mass transit system?
No SUV..it has been a while since I have been on this forum, and your posts crack me up every time I read them. Are you seriously saying that slugging clogs up HOV lanes but SOV Hybrids don't? HUH???? And to talk about cheating.....nah, I won't even waste my time! |
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NoSUV
Advanced Member
1076 Posts |
Posted - 04/12/2007 : 09:26:12
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tangelo - the DC area per the census bureau is the 8th largest metro area, but it has either the 2nd or 3rd worst commute, depending on which source you want to use. It's also the only area that has a slug system. Coincedence? Nope.
As you have pointed out in another post, at times the slug line is rather long. What would happen if all of the slugs were on mass transit instead of private vehicles? Would the number of cars on the road go down? OF COURSE!
That clears the relatively minor jam in the express lanes, but doesn't help the regular lanes out. Solution? Pull some of the vehicles from the regular lanes into the express lanes and everybody wins. EVERYBODY.
However, a discriminator needs to be made between which cars can go in the express lanes, and which cannot. With global warming a, well, global concern, it makes sense to use the discriminator of SULEV - and it's been proven in Virginia that such an incetive works VERY WELL.
The other possibility is through a fee, which might be referred to as a toll. In this case, you would have to charge ALL vehicles more than the price of mass transit, which would put the slugs where they belong on buses and allow folks with too much money in the regular lanes a way to buy their way out of the congestion.
Which do you prefer? We all know the current situation won't work... |
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MDC
Moderator
638 Posts |
Posted - 04/12/2007 : 11:08:34
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| I think I've seen the light. Slugging causes long commutes! Amazing! |
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Hybrid Congestion
Forum Locked
