Hybrids - A proposal for hybrids

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A proposal for hybrids

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Category: Archived Slugging Topics
Forum Name: Hybrids
Forum Description: This area is devoted to the discussion of hybrid vehicles and their impact to the HOV.
URL: http://www.slug-lines.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=463
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Topic: A proposal for hybrids

Posted By: Bob
Subject: A proposal for hybrids
Date Posted: 17 Apr 2003 at 10:07am

Allowing hybrids and other alternative fuel cars on I-95 HOV with one occupant is giving them a double benefit because the highway is HOV-3. As I understand it, hybrids are allowed in most of the HOV lanes in the U.S. However, many of the HOV lanes around the country are HOV-2, and the hybrid is only getting a reduction of one person. I-95 is HOV-3 so they are getting a double benefit.

A more logical approach (until our HOV system becomes jammed up with hybrids) would be to allow a reduction of one occupant for a given HOV type. Once it is obvious to the powers that be that allowing hybrids is a mistake, then the hybrid exception will be dropped.

Does anyone have any info on other HOVs around the country, what they are doing with hybrids, and whether hybrids are popular elsewhere?

Replies:

Posted By: 3ForHOV
Date Posted: 17 Apr 2003 at 11:01am

My understanding of how hybrids work is this...they use GASOLINE when they are on the highway and switch over to ELECTRIC for inner city/suburb driving. If this is the case, they should be considered like every other gas guzzling vehicle out there and should obide with the HOV-3 rule.

I consider myself a conservationist/environmentalist and if I owned a hybrid, I would still swing by and pick up slugs on my way to work.

Posted By: Vema
Date Posted: 17 Apr 2003 at 12:20pm

Hear!!!! Hear!!!!

quote:
Originally posted by 3ForHOV
[br]My understanding of how hybrids work is this...they use GASOLINE when they are on the highway and switch over to ELECTRIC for inner city/suburb driving. If this is the case, they should be considered like every other gas guzzling vehicle out there and should obide with the HOV-3 rule.

I consider myself a conservationist/environmentalist and if I owned a hybrid, I would still swing by and pick up slugs on my way to work.

Posted By: wdossel
Date Posted: 17 Apr 2003 at 12:49pm

quote:
Originally posted by 3ForHOV
[br]My understanding of how hybrids work is this...they use GASOLINE when they are on the highway and switch over to ELECTRIC for inner city/suburb driving. If this is the case, they should be considered like every other gas guzzling vehicle out there and should obide with the HOV-3 rule.

I consider myself a conservationist/environmentalist and if I owned a hybrid, I would still swing by and pick up slugs on my way to work.

Absolutely -- as I found myself the other day w/3 slugs onboard and surrounded by 4 hybrids (3 Hondas and a Prius) with only a driver, I'm thinking to myself, "what's wrong with this picture..." I should probably mention the line for PM was particularly long that day too.

- Will

Posted By: swichowski
Date Posted: 17 Apr 2003 at 1:03pm

Someone told me there is a lady that picks up people in a Hybrid every day. I think at 610

Posted By: MDC
Date Posted: 17 Apr 2003 at 9:46pm

All but the least common hybrid have 4 doors.. They should make use of all that passenger space. If the extension of their exception goes through, well over half of the vehicles in the HOV lanes will be hybrids before the next time it comes up.

As I understand it, only Virginia has the exception for hybrids regarding HOV. The Feds do not approve of the practice(permitting single occupant vehicles on hov), and may force their hand. I do not know if this is the case, but it is how one of the Virginia websites characterized the situation.

Posted By: tdar20
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2003 at 7:55am

Well, there is a lot of mis-information about Hybrids out there as to how they operate. It does not switch over for city driving to the Hybrid power. When you are cruising along is when it works best. That being said I think the bigger problem is the HOV violators out there. Yesterday going home on the HOV lane at 4:00 pm was clogged with violators. Where is the enforcement?? It gets to the point that when you are driving at 6:30 am and 4 pm it is clogged with cars violating the rule. Would be nice to see enforcement stepped up.

Posted By: MDC
Date Posted: 19 Apr 2003 at 3:09am

In my opinion, there are a lot more "legal" single occupancy vehicles, than violators most of the time. The solution is to make HOV, HOV-4 or 5, so there's room for all the "legal" single occupancy vehicles before it's too late.

Either that, or cut down the exemptions.

Posted By: mycroftt
Date Posted: 21 Apr 2003 at 8:44am

quote:
Originally posted by MDC
[br]In my opinion, there are a lot more "legal" single occupancy vehicles, than violators most of the time. The solution is to make HOV, HOV-4 or 5, so there's room for all the "legal" single occupancy vehicles before it's too late.

Either that, or cut down the exemptions.

Posted By: swichowski
Date Posted: 21 Apr 2003 at 8:56am

Thats how it is now I thought. [:)]

Posted By: 3ForHOV
Date Posted: 21 Apr 2003 at 10:19am

I propose that the HOV lanes be reserved strictly for "exception" vehicles. The special lanes should be for special people only - diplomats, law enforcement, the very rich, and lawyers. Let the cars carying multiple passengers ride in the regular lanes with the rest of the peasants.

Mike[:o)][8][:o)]

[?]Wonder what would happen if we boycotted the HOV lanes for a day.[?] Guess the cops would have to call in for backup to get the cheaters since there wouldn't be any non-violators in the lanes. We would have to do it at the end of the month because that's usually when they make their presence.
I know, this is just wishful thinking. I'll go back to sleep now.

Posted By: Mr. Bill
Date Posted: 29 Apr 2003 at 11:56am

I think that one of the reasons to buy a Hybrid is the HOV exemption. My guess is that there would be fewer buyers if they got no extra benefit for the cost. Other comments:

(1) Besides the HOV violators, the group that bothers me is the 9am and 6pm shoulder sitters club. These cars are just an accident waiting to happen.
(2) It would better if they would extend the HOV in VA to 6:30 as it is in MD.
(3) I wish that there were more HOV enforcement. Who do the violators think that they are?

Posted By: lotsa
Date Posted: 30 Apr 2003 at 7:50am

Who do the violators think they are? Well, from the few I've talked to who have admitted being violators, they think in a way that is not good for the big picture, only what is good for them as an individual. Unfortunately, that is one of the reasons that we need laws - because of people who think like that. Now, if we only had someone with some horse sense making the decisions about who is and isn't allowed in the HOV lanes. I also agree with the 6:30pm extension for HOV hours. Years ago it was 6:30pm, but the single drivers complained big time, and, well...you can see what the outcvome was.

Posted By: 3ForHOV
Date Posted: 02 May 2003 at 10:01am

quote:
Originally posted by lotsa
[br]Who do the violators think they are? Well, from the few I've talked to who have admitted being violators, they think in a way that is not good for the big picture, only what is good for them as an individual. Unfortunately, that is one of the reasons that we need laws - because of people who think like that. Now, if we only had someone with some horse sense making the decisions about who is and isn't allowed in the HOV lanes. I also agree with the 6:30pm extension for HOV hours. Years ago it was 6:30pm, but the single drivers complained big time, and, well...you can see what the outcvome was.

Posted By: 3ForHOV
Date Posted: 02 May 2003 at 10:11am

quote:
Originally posted by 3ForHOV
[br]
Originally posted by lotsa
[br]Who do the violators think they are? Well, from the few I've talked to who have admitted being violators, they think in a way that is not good for the big picture, only what is good for them as an individual. Unfortunately, that is one of the reasons that we need laws - because of people who think like that.

Unfortunately, these are the same people who think they are above the law and will continue about their own business. There's reason why they are included in the food chain -- without them, the cops and state wouldn't make any money and our taxes would go up. I'm so fed up with them that I've chosen to ignore them and maybe one day they'll get busted.

Posted By: mroyal
Date Posted: 27 May 2003 at 4:03pm

As new (co)owner of a Honda Hybrid, I can say without hesitation that HOV access was a strong reason for purchasing. Why?
Because my wife's work location and times do not readily support carpool and/or mass transit. Why not pick up slugs?
Two reasons,
1) She is not comfortable doing so if she is the only one in the car.
2) It is simply not convenient (Pentagon would add 30 minutes to her commute) and..
okay three,
3) She doesn't need to. That's why we bought the car.

So, the incentive for creating HOV is to remove vehicles from the road. Instead of three vehicles, you have one. It's also an incentive to buy a vehicle that uses (at least) 1/3 less energy resources and generates (at least) 1/3 less emmissions.

Note: I slug every day only because its more convenient for me than any other mode of commute. Government commuter subsidies have eliminated the economical reasons.

Posted By: MDC
Date Posted: 27 May 2003 at 8:58pm

mroyal,
Of course picking up slugs or slugging takes more time than driving your car in the HOV lanes with no passengers. It does for everyone.

Hybrids do nothing to alleviate congestion. They use much more than 1/3 as much gas as the average car. Heck, they don't even qualify for the Virginia "Clean Fuel" license plates as the law was originally written.

Posted By: Arbo
Date Posted: 28 May 2003 at 7:44am

MDC - AMEN!

Posted By: gg
Date Posted: 28 May 2003 at 8:47am

mroyal,

The first reason for not picking up slugs because your wife is not comfortable -- a really lame excuse. There is no guarantee that you might pick up someone a little odd but for the years that I've been slugging, I have yet to encounter someone absolutely objectionable. You seem to understand the principles behind this system and it's unfortunate that you couldn't convince your wife. Your third reason, because she doesn't need to, is really shoving "it" [V] into our faces (I used the word face as a substitute for another word).

gg

Posted By: mroyal
Date Posted: 28 May 2003 at 1:05pm

Not shoving anything, and I apologize if that is the way it was received. I'm just stating facts. My point is that I and many others slug for convenience and/or cost savings. If it were more convenient and/or cheaper (as well as legal) to drive solo, then my bet is that we all would. The Hybrid does in fact use 1/3 less gas than my other vehicle and a lot more than 1/3 less emmisions.
It is currently more convenient and cheaper for my wife to drive solo. You (collectively) have noticed the fact that the HOV incentive to buy hybrids is causing more hybrids to be sold in metro areas. This increases the market and provides automakers with an incentive to build more. So, what do we do when the number of hybrids (with solo drivers) outnumber the vehicles with 3 persons onboard? That is a good question and a perhaps a good problem to have. I suspect that the answer is to figure out a way to balance the incentives.

btw,
Slugging in not a religion or something we do for the good of the mankind. If you think that it is and/or that is your incentive, then good for you. There are other things I can do for mankind.

Posted By: mroyal
Date Posted: 28 May 2003 at 1:14pm

quote:
Originally posted by gg
[br]mroyal,

The first reason for not picking up slugs because your wife is not comfortable -- a really lame excuse. There is no guarantee that you might pick up someone a little odd but for the years that I've been slugging, I have yet to encounter someone absolutely objectionable. You seem to understand the principles behind this system and it's unfortunate that you couldn't convince your wife. Your third reason, because she doesn't need to, is really shoving "it" [V] into our faces (I used the word face as a substitute for another word).

gg

I must also add that you don't have any idea whether the first "excuse" is lame or not. That which is comfortable or at least acceptable to one person may have a complete opposite affect an another person. The fact that someone is uncomfortable flying in an airplane and thereby avoiding flying is not a "lame excuse" for not flying. It is a completely valid "excuse."

No flame intended,
mroyal

Posted By: tdar20
Date Posted: 29 May 2003 at 7:56am

GG, got to agree with MROYAl on this. Who are you to determine if his wife is uncomfortable with slugs or not?? I believe it is her decision, therefore stating it is lame is out of line. We all have a right to make the decision to slug, drive or take any other method to get to our jobs.

Posted By: mycroftt
Date Posted: 29 May 2003 at 8:31am

quote:
Originally posted by mroyal

You (collectively) have noticed the fact that the HOV incentive to buy hybrids is causing more hybrids to be sold in metro areas. This increases the market and provides automakers with an incentive to build more. So, what do we do when the number of hybrids (with solo drivers) outnumber the vehicles with 3 persons onboard? That is a good question and a perhaps a good problem to have. I suspect that the answer is to figure out a way to balance the incentives.

If you are inferring that you believe that hybrids (or maybe some other as yet unidentified alternate-type vehicle) will come to rule the auto market, I tend to agree. I think that market pressures, including incentives like tax breaks or free passes to HOV, will bring that about, but my guess is that the incentives will become less important in driving the market to hybrids/alternatives and will fall by the wayside. So I don't think we will ever see the day when solo hybrids actually outnumber HOV3's.

Just my $1.49 per gallon's worth...

Mike

Posted By: mirangus
Date Posted: 29 May 2003 at 8:50am

quote:

Just my $1.49 per gallon's worth...

Mike

Wow...where do you get gas!?!?! [:o)] Just Kidding... [:D]

Posted By: mirangus
Date Posted: 29 May 2003 at 9:55am

I can completely understand someone not wanting to use slugging as an answer to commuting, for whatever reason.

I'm willing to put money on this. Everyone who slugs or picks up slugs has told others about how they get to work an come across those who are just completely astonished and taken aback at what a risky thing you do on a daily basis. My parents absolutely loathe the fact that I slug/pick up slugs. My father is constantly on my back to take the train (then I ask him if he wants to pay for it...[;)]). Some folks will never be convinced that slugging is an OK thing to do. When I was first told of how this whole system worked, I was pretty floored as well, knowing all the trust and mutual respect needed to be involved (that you rarely see) to make such a system work. The only thing that made me feel safe was my military background and keen foresight for danger and knowing that if anything went down I had a better chance of reacting correctly that not. Not everyone has the benefit of that confidence to keep themselves from a dangerous situation. Or maybe they have already had a bad experience and trusting others may be a serious issue. It's hard to tell. I'd give someone the benefit of the doubt. Besides, I'd rather the skittish folks do their own thing instead of sitting in my vehicle, likely to flip out if I take a different route to circumvent an accident!!

Posted By: gg
Date Posted: 29 May 2003 at 10:03am

mroyal,

You've made a number of points and I would like to address each one but this post would be extremely long and would be inappropriate. So, I'll counter your one point about your wife's excuse not being lame. I used the word lame defined as being weak, that is, a weak excuse. I just took your choice of the word uncomfortable to mean how it is defined, causing discomfort or annoyance. Being uncomfortable is a relative term and could range from "I don't feel like it" to a raging fit.

There is not much about slugging that is comfortable, other than it's convenient, timely, no cost (for the slugs), and could spark interesting conversations. Additionally, I find it somewhat satisfying knowing that everyone meets their needs and this system significantly helps with the traffic and environment. But this forum is entrenched with people's complaints about everything under the sun because they feel "uncomfortable". For example, people don't like it when a slug snores, or that a car speeds, or that the radio is tuned to a station not pc, or that...

Nevertheless, we do it because it makes sense and tolerate all the possible negatives about slugging. On the other hand, if your wife is really afraid of being in car with a couple of strangers, then I can understand that sentiment and I could not justify forcing someone against their will. But I believe I have the right to call her excuse lame if she is uncomfortable, using the true sense of the word. If the analogy of feeling uncomfortable flying is like slugging, and you're implying that your wife really has a phobia about slugging, then that fear is legitimate and therefore her excuse is not lame but a resplendent excuse that I cannot criticize. If this is the case, it did not come across that way in your first post and I apologize.

The shadowing point of my previous post was to say that hybrids are not the answer to our traffic mess. IMHO, hybrid drivers are elitists and the whole thing seems unfair. Now, in your wife's case, I just made assumptions and responded accordingly.

tdar20, he said that is wife is uncomfortable with others in the car, I did not have to determine that fact. I am stating that her excuse is lame, not her decision. You are right that everyone has the right to make their decisions, but I don't have the right to call someone's excuse lame?

-- no flames intended toward anyone at this time, but I might reconsider later [:)]
gg

Posted By: gg
Date Posted: 29 May 2003 at 10:17am

mirangus,

Have you noticed how many women slug? a lot, I would guess 50%. I think that says a lot about the system.

When you said you had a military background I assumed that you were a man, but then again I can't tell from your post. But if you are a man with a military background, doesn't that make it even more astonishing? Now, if you are a woman, I am not trying to lessen the point but commend all the women that slug.

gg

Posted By: mirangus
Date Posted: 29 May 2003 at 2:25pm

quote:
Originally posted by gg
[br]mirangus,

Have you noticed how many women slug? a lot, I would guess 50%. I think that says a lot about the system.

When you said you had a military background I assumed that you were a man, but then again I can't tell from your post. But if you are a man with a military background, doesn't that make it even more astonishing? Now, if you are a woman, I am not trying to lessen the point but commend all the women that slug.

gg

gg-

I am female and the reason that I brought up my military background was actually to accentuate my point. That without the preparedness that I received from the military to deal with dangerous situations, I, myself, might be hesitant to use the slug system. I would probably still do it, but not feel as OK with it. But I guess since I neglected to state my gender, I can see how my point may not have hit home. Sorry for the exclusion.

However, on the same note as before... 50% of sluggers may very well be women, but even that fact may not be enough for some women to feel comfortable slugging, esp. when you take into account the chances of riding in a vehicle with 2 other men. Some may have difficulties with that in their mind. In comparison, 50% of those who walk around in DC alone at night may be women, but you can sure bet that I won't be one of them unless there is a REALLY good reason, know what I mean?? [;)]

Like I said before, if I didn't have confidence that I could take care of myself in the event of a nasty situation, I may have been hesitant to slug. Now, I've been slugging for a few years now and know, from experience, that a bad situation is NOT likely to happen. But I had the self-confidence BEFORE I started slugging and that made all the difference. Others may not be feeling as well prepared as me or you and don't want to slug. That's their choice and perfectly OK. Oh, BTW, I'm not even limiting the hesitation to just women. I know some men that would never slug.

I hope this clarifies for you what I was trying to state earlier. [:)]

Posted By: gg
Date Posted: 29 May 2003 at 4:00pm

Mirangus,

You have made yourself perfectly clear. Thank you.

gg

Posted By: mroyal
Date Posted: 31 May 2003 at 6:56pm

Very good replies, all.

We are well met.

If you will allow one final comment, I'll step aside for any last words. You may have noticed my quotations are the word "excuse." My wife being uncomfortable is the reason that she doesn't pick up slugs; it is not the excuse. An excuse is not necessary, as she is breaking no rules - neither legal, or moral.

Kindest Regards,

mroyal

Posted By: Megled
Date Posted: 04 Jun 2003 at 4:07pm

No need to feel you must explain yourself to such a degree to people who spout off as gg does. tdar hit in on the head and gg is way out of line. However your wife feels is valid and how anyone else feels about her reasons is totally irrevlant. Take care!

quote:
Originally posted by mroyal
[br]Very good replies, all.

We are well met.

If you will allow one final comment, I'll step aside for any last words. You may have noticed my quotations are the word "excuse." My wife being uncomfortable is the reason that she doesn't pick up slugs; it is not the excuse. An excuse is not necessary, as she is breaking no rules - neither legal, or moral.

Kindest Regards,

mroyal

Posted By: mroyal
Date Posted: 25 Jul 2003 at 2:57pm

No specific message, I just wanted to raise this thread back to the top, since it is so related to the other hybrid thread.

Kindest Regards,

mroyal

Posted By: vabigblue
Date Posted: 28 Jul 2003 at 1:12pm

quote:
Originally posted by mroyal
[br]No specific message, I just wanted to raise this thread back to the top, since it is so related to the other hybrid thread.

Kindest Regards,

mroyal

I must say mroyal, you enjoy keeping these threads going. To push a little further, is there any news on when the state government will take these vehicles out of the HOV lanes unless they have three or more riders? Again, I find it amazing that some vehicles qualify for HOV with no riders when others do not. I have seen or heard nothing from an environmental standpoint that qualifies hybrids for HOV access. A vehicle is a vehicle is a vehicle and they all should be treated the same. All these thousands of vehicles each day travel up and down I-95 emitting "whatever" into the environment. Now, tell me why or how one vehicle, because of its make-up can all of a sudden clean up the area by driving in the HOV lanes? It makes no sense and the law should be, drive with one rider and drive in regular lanes. This is one rule I do not and never will understand, regardless of [?] gas/electrical mileage. Based on what I saw this a.m., the HOV lanes are full of hybrids, some with other riders inside but the majority, single drivers. But that's the law and we'll abide by it until it changes, which should be in the very near future if it continues the way it is now. Thanks

Posted By: viper
Date Posted: 28 Jul 2003 at 3:18pm

quote:
Originally posted by mroyal
[br]Very good replies, all.

We are well met.

If you will allow one final comment, I'll step aside for any last words. You may have noticed my quotations are the word "excuse." My wife being uncomfortable is the reason that she doesn't pick up slugs; it is not the excuse. An excuse is not necessary, as she is breaking no rules - neither legal, or moral.

Kindest Regards,

mroyal

mroyal,

Just because you have the "right" to do something does not make it right.

Buying your way onto the HOV (that stands for "high occupancy vehicle") is simply taking advantage of the current rules for one's self at the expense of others. The old "looking out for number one."

If many more people take your position and follow in your footsteps we'll have a clogged HOV and more pollutants in the air.

V/R
Viper

Posted By: tlschau
Date Posted: 30 Jul 2003 at 10:34am

Keep in mine everyone that Virginia can undo or change the law regarding hybrids and HOV lanes at any time. And given federal influence on such matters I would say that a change will likely occur sooner rather than later.

Posted By: bernestih
Date Posted: 01 Aug 2003 at 9:09am

Hi All

It is my understanding that the hybrids are only allowed to utilize the HOV under 2004, Otherwise, HOV will be like the regular lanes. . .hmmmmmm.

Posted By: mroyal
Date Posted: 04 Aug 2003 at 9:58am

quote:
Originally posted by vabigblue
[br]
quote:
Originally posted by mroyal
[br]No specific message, I just wanted to raise this thread back to the top, since it is so related to the other hybrid thread.

Kindest Regards,

mroyal

I must say mroyal, you enjoy keeping these threads going. To push a little further, is there any news on when the state government will take these vehicles out of the HOV lanes unless they have three or more riders? Again, I find it amazing that some vehicles qualify for HOV with no riders when others do not. I have seen or heard nothing from an environmental standpoint that qualifies hybrids for HOV access. A vehicle is a vehicle is a vehicle and they all should be treated the same. All these thousands of vehicles each day travel up and down I-95 emitting "whatever" into the environment. Now, tell me why or how one vehicle, because of its make-up can all of a sudden clean up the area by driving in the HOV lanes? It makes no sense and the law should be, drive with one rider and drive in regular lanes. This is one rule I do not and never will understand, regardless of [?] gas/electrical mileage. Based on what I saw this a.m., the HOV lanes are full of hybrids, some with other riders inside but the majority, single drivers. But that's the law and we'll abide by it until it changes, which should be in the very near future if it continues the way it is now. Thanks

I am surprised to read that you know what I enjoy, but your statements such as "This is one rule I do not and never will understand..." is enough for me to not try to explain. There are sufficient questions and answers in these two threads to allow rational understanding of the situation. There are also statements, which I consider to be irrational, such as "The HOV lanes are full of hybrids..."

If you have read my opinions, they are:
The Clean Fuel exemption for HOV is a good thing.
The Hybrids are recognized by Federal and State laws as Clean Fuel vehicles.
It's okay to have single occupancy in HOV when it is legal.
I think the Law Enforcement exemption is abused by government officials (especially Feds.)
There will come a time when there will be too many Clean Fuel vehicles in the HOV lane.
The time is not now.
But, when that happens, the law should be changed.

Other subjects:
I am totally against HOT, unless they are separated from HOV.
I am in favor of HOV2 on I-95 outside of the beltway.

In case you missed it, I don't drive a hybrid, my wife does. I am a slugger, out of convenience and economy.

Your mileage may vary,

Kindest Regards,

mroyal

Posted By: mroyal
Date Posted: 04 Aug 2003 at 10:07am

quote:
Originally posted by viper
[br]
quote:
Originally posted by mroyal
[br]Very good replies, all.

We are well met.

If you will allow one final comment, I'll step aside for any last words. You may have noticed my quotations are the word "excuse." My wife being uncomfortable is the reason that she doesn't pick up slugs; it is not the excuse. An excuse is not necessary, as she is breaking no rules - neither legal, or moral.

Kindest Regards,

mroyal

mroyal,

Just because you have the "right" to do something does not make it right.

Buying your way onto the HOV (that stands for "high occupancy vehicle") is simply taking advantage of the current rules for one's self at the expense of others. The old "looking out for number one."

If many more people take your position and follow in your footsteps we'll have a clogged HOV and more pollutants in the air.

V/R
Viper

Interesting.
So, just because I have the right to make a deduction on my income tax, that doesn't mean I should. Just because I am able to "buy into" a new home and claim a deduction on mortgage interest, I shouldn't, because renters are not afforded the same deduction. Just because I am married...
Naw, sorry. It doesn't pan out.

"..and more pollutants in the air."

Nope, just the opposite.

Kindest Regards,

mroyal

Posted By: vabigblue
Date Posted: 06 Aug 2003 at 9:40am

quote:
Originally posted by mroyal
[br]
quote:
Originally posted by vabigblue
[br]
quote:
Originally posted by mroyal
[br]No specific message, I just wanted to raise this thread back to the top, since it is so related to the other hybrid thread.

Kindest Regards,

mroyal

I must say mroyal, you enjoy keeping these threads going. To push a little further, is there any news on when the state government will take these vehicles out of the HOV lanes unless they have three or more riders? Again, I find it amazing that some vehicles qualify for HOV with no riders when others do not. I have seen or heard nothing from an environmental standpoint that qualifies hybrids for HOV access. A vehicle is a vehicle is a vehicle and they all should be treated the same. All these thousands of vehicles each day travel up and down I-95 emitting "whatever" into the environment. Now, tell me why or how one vehicle, because of its make-up can all of a sudden clean up the area by driving in the HOV lanes? It makes no sense and the law should be, drive with one rider and drive in regular lanes. This is one rule I do not and never will understand, regardless of [?] gas/electrical mileage. Based on what I saw this a.m., the HOV lanes are full of hybrids, some with other riders inside but the majority, single drivers. But that's the law and we'll abide by it until it changes, which should be in the very near future if it continues the way it is now. Thanks

I am surprised to read that you know what I enjoy, but your statements such as "This is one rule I do not and never will understand..." is enough for me to not try to explain. There are sufficient questions and answers in these two threads to allow rational understanding of the situation. There are also statements, which I consider to be irrational, such as "The HOV lanes are full of hybrids..."

If you have read my opinions, they are:
The Clean Fuel exemption for HOV is a good thing.
The Hybrids are recognized by Federal and State laws as Clean Fuel vehicles.
It's okay to have single occupancy in HOV when it is legal.
I think the Law Enforcement exemption is abused by government officials (especially Feds.)
There will come a time when there will be too many Clean Fuel vehicles in the HOV lane.
The time is not now.
But, when that happens, the law should be changed.

Other subjects:
I am totally against HOT, unless they are separated from HOV.
I am in favor of HOV2 on I-95 outside of the beltway.

In case you missed it, I don't drive a hybrid, my wife does. I am a slugger, out of convenience and economy.

Your mileage may vary,

Kindest Regards,

mroyal

Oh, I understand what you "enjoy". You're no different than anyone else. You own a hybrid, so I expect you to make these excuses and differences. It still does not make it proper to ride in HOV lanes alone. How 'bout "clean air vehicles" for regular lanes? I mean, if HOV lanes were separated from regular lanes by a mile or so, I could understand your rational; however, these lanes are separated by jersey walls only. How much sense does that make to say "the clean fuel exemption for HOV is a good thing"? Come on, you must admit, with as many vehicles as we have out there, everything mixes and there's no such thing as "clean fuel" along the I-95 corridor. Again, your points are valid ones, only to you and other hybrid owners. As you can see, understanding folks, such non-hybrid owners make valid points as well and to me, these points are easier to understand rather than submitting this c/r/a/p about "clean fuel exemption for HOV". Thanks

Posted By: VA_Slugger
Date Posted: 06 Aug 2003 at 12:21pm

Vabigblue, well said about the distance between the HOV lane and the "regular" lane. But, mroyal has some valid points too. Why not take advantage of the "savings" and do "what you can" for the environment. Just an observation. Good Day to all!

Posted By: vabigblue
Date Posted: 07 Aug 2003 at 8:25am

quote:
Originally posted by VA_Slugger
[br]Vabigblue, well said about the distance between the HOV lane and the "regular" lane. But, mroyal has some valid points too. Why not take advantage of the "savings" and do "what you can" for the environment. Just an observation. Good Day to all!

Posted By: vabigblue
Date Posted: 07 Aug 2003 at 8:30am

quote:
Originally posted by VA_Slugger
[br]Vabigblue, well said about the distance between the HOV lane and the "regular" lane. But, mroyal has some valid points too. Why not take advantage of the "savings" and do "what you can" for the environment. Just an observation. Good Day to all!

Thanks "Slugger". I certainly am for the good of the environment; however, that doesn't seem to be all there is to it with this thread. I said what I thought was necessary and won't resond to any more "hhybrid" posts. It's all just an opinion and I won't try to change anyone else's just voice mine at the appropriate opportunity. Thanks again.

Posted By: MDC
Date Posted: 08 Aug 2003 at 9:53pm

If they hybrid owners are driving them to help keep the environment clean, they should be in the regular lanes. They would get better mileage, and better emmissions there according to everything I've read on "hybrid" gas-electric technology.

1 is not HOV.

Posted By: mroyal
Date Posted: 10 Aug 2003 at 11:55am

Ya'll just don't get it. I'll try one last time, then I give up.
The government wants to provide enough incentive to get people to buy low emmision vehicles.

The question is "What is the proper level of incentive?"
For some, high MPG does it.
For others, environmental issues do it.

But HOV4-1 was *the* incentive that caused my family to buy a hybrid. Without that incentive, we would have purchased some other vehicle.

So, the incentive is working.

Kindest Regards,

mroyal

Posted By: eziggy3
Date Posted: 12 Aug 2003 at 12:18pm

It's actually 2006. Go Hybrid!

quote:
Originally posted by bernestih
[br]Hi All

It is my understanding that the hybrids are only allowed to utilize the HOV under 2004, Otherwise, HOV will be like the regular lanes. . .hmmmmmm.

eziggy3

Posted By: eziggy3
Date Posted: 12 Aug 2003 at 12:21pm

Posted By: MDC
Date Posted: 12 Aug 2003 at 8:05pm

It's like an excuse because people using HOV without passengers are relying on an exemption to the law. They are called High Occupancy lanes for a reason.

Posted By: Arbo
Date Posted: 13 Aug 2003 at 11:57am

To me, the real question is whether the people buying hybrids would have bought them if they couldn't use the HOV lanes by themselves. I know one person in my office bought their's for that reason only .

Posted By: mirangus
Date Posted: 13 Aug 2003 at 7:03pm

Arbo-

That is an awesome point!! I have talked to many others with similar stories, that they purchased a hybrid for the express purpose of riding in the HOV alone. Too many. Now don't get me wrong, I have no opinion at all concerning hybrids in the HOV lanes. It's not causing that much congestion right now. Maybe it will later, but it will be reconsidered in 3 years, so they'll canx it at that time if necessary. Not to mention that it's part of the law right now, so more power to 'em.

What gets me is everyone who defends their choice of getting a hybrid because of their "positive effects on the environment." And they are saying this while they are riding by themselves, smoking a cigarette. Get real.

Now this isn't for everyone. Those who are concerned about the environment and are motivated as such are usually carrying 2 more passengers/slugs as well as themselves. But for the others...at least be honest with yourselves and say "I have a hybrid to suit my own needs." Hybrids save money on gas (allegedly) and make the commute time that much faster...nothin' wrong with that. Heck, if I could stand the looks of any of the hybrids currently on the market, I might be tempted to do the same thing, I can't say for sure. But don't get on here and tout your ecological virtues while you're by yourself in your hybrid.

Posted By: mroyal
Date Posted: 14 Aug 2003 at 8:04am

quote:
Originally posted by mirangus
[br]Arbo-

That is an awesome point!! I have talked to many others with similar stories, that they purchased a hybrid for the express purpose of riding in the HOV alone.

We did. The rest of the benefits is icing.

quote:

Too many. Now don't get me wrong, I have no opinion at all concerning hybrids in the HOV lanes. It's not causing that much congestion right now. Maybe it will later, but it will be reconsidered in 3 years, so they'll canx it at that time if necessary. Not to mention that it's part of the law right now, so more power to 'em.

Thank you

quote:

What gets me is everyone who defends their choice of getting a hybrid because of their "positive effects on the environment." And they are saying this while they are riding by themselves, smoking a cigarette. Get real.

We don't smoke. But my other car is a SUV.

quote:

Now this isn't for everyone. Those who are concerned about the environment and are motivated as such are usually carrying 2 more passengers/slugs as well as themselves. But for the others...at least be honest with yourselves and say "I have a hybrid to suit my own needs." Hybrids save money on gas (allegedly) and make the commute time that much faster...nothin' wrong with that.

That's all I have ever said. Convenience and economy.

quote:

Heck, if I could stand the looks of any of the hybrids currently on the market, I might be tempted to do the same thing, I can't say for sure.

That's why the Civic is so popular. First time they used a regular body style.

quote:

But don't get on here and tout your ecological virtues while you're by yourself in your hybrid.

Okay, fair enough (but I never touted my virtues.)

Kindest Regards,

mroyal

Posted By: Bob
Date Posted: 14 Aug 2003 at 2:09pm

To mroyal,

I would like to request that you not take everyone else's message apart in segments and respond to each sentence. That is very irritating and unnecessary. It has the effect of intimidating others into not posting messages. Is that your intent?

Bob

Posted By: eziggy3
Date Posted: 14 Aug 2003 at 2:22pm

quote:
Originally posted by Bob
[br]To mroyal,

I would like to request that you not take everyone else's message apart in segments and respond to each sentence. That is very irritating and unnecessary. It has the effect of intimidating others into not posting messages. Is that your intent?

Bob

I think you don't like what he is saying.

I too am purchasing a hybrid so I can ride the HOV. Hey, it's the law right. I couldn't care less about the enviornmental implecations. Maybe a tiny bit.

Go Go Hybrid
eziggy3

Posted By: mroyal
Date Posted: 14 Aug 2003 at 3:00pm

quote:
Originally posted by Bob
[br]To mroyal,

I would like to request that you not take everyone else's message apart in segments and respond to each sentence.

I'll consider your request.

quote:

That is very irritating and unnecessary.

Sometimes it is necessary. I guess it could quickly become irritating though.

quote:

It has the effect of intimidating others into not posting messages. Is that your intent?

Nope, was that your intent?

Kindest Regards,

mroyal

Posted By: tdar20
Date Posted: 14 Aug 2003 at 3:12pm

MROYAL....funny one but your right about the irritating!!

Posted By: mirangus
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2003 at 10:04am

quote:

But don't get on here and tout your ecological virtues while you're by yourself in your hybrid.

Okay, fair enough (but I never touted my virtues.)

Kindest Regards,

mroyal

OK, I know that you are very vocal on the subject of hybrids, as evident on the THREE threads of hybrid discussion that are happening lately, and that you seem to be the center of attention in all of them. But, and this may come as a surprise to you, my previous comments were not directed at YOU!! They were general comments designed to call attention to some hypocracy that had not yet been highlighted on these threads, not to try to make you look like a bad guy. Honestly!

Relax. Not everyone is out to get you. Like I said, I personally don't care about hybrids on the HOV (as evident by how much I DON'T weigh in in these threads).

But thanks for the dissection of my comments, anyway. I feel so...violated. [B)]

Posted By: adjguy
Date Posted: 12 Sep 2003 at 6:02pm

quote:
Originally posted by 3ForHOV
[br]My understanding of how hybrids work is this...they use GASOLINE when they are on the highway and switch over to ELECTRIC for inner city/suburb driving. If this is the case, they should be considered like every other gas guzzling vehicle out there and should obide with the HOV-3 rule.

I consider myself a conservationist/environmentalist and if I owned a hybrid, I would still swing by and pick up slugs on my way to work.

Hello. I own a Hybrid. My wife drives it to work everyday. She takes it to Tysons Corner VIA 95HOV - the GW Pkywy North. I myself work in DC, and am a slug rider. I bought the Hybrid for two reasons, and two reasons only. So my wife could use the HOV, and so I can reduce my use of fuels (sticking it to the Oil Cartel every which way I can). I spent 19K on the Honda 4 door hybrid automatic. It gets over 45MPG, which is how much my regular Honda civic gets, or your average VW Passat, or even a Corolla. Your stats on the hybrid, were im afraid, wrong. The car does not "switch" over to Electric in the city. It uses the electric engine for "assist" during accelleration, which means that the car does not put out EMISSIONS, like your EMISSIONS emitting regular cars. So, the reason that the hybrids are allowed to use the HOV is not for the MILEAGE, its due to the extreamly low EMISSIONS. When the car is stopped at a stop light, and your vehicle is running, using GASOLINE, my wifes hybrid is OFF. The car shuts off in Idleing, IE traffic lights, or slow moving traffic.... I am very tired of the Hybrids getting knocked everyday...."my car gets close to the milage that the hybrid gets", "its not fair". Please get the facts straight. Its the EMISSIONS, NOT THE MILAGE. Our hybrid emmits 10% of the pollutants that your average joe's car in this area.

What do I think of the rule? I have mixed feelings. I think there should be some type of insentive to own a gas/electric car, as it is the only way to reduce our need for foreign oil, and clean our air. I wonder if there is something that can be done in the future to make everyone happy.

I have some room to gripe, as I am a die hard slugger everyday, and have both evils. I own a Hybrid. No hard feelings though, Im not trying to be a jerk, but its the only way for me to convey the message, as with everyone else here, I am entitled to an opinion....and a spelling class..... I think this is a great system, and hope it continues to run smoothly. And if the law does change again, my wife, im sure will be more than willing to pick some slugs up in her hybrid[:D]
Sorry, but my spelling does indeed stink, I was a victim of the public school system[;)]

Thanks ya'll for your time, and the oportunity to express my opinion.
JB

Posted By: dickboyd
Date Posted: 10 Aug 2005 at 8:26pm

quote:
Originally posted by Bob
[br]Allowing hybrids and other alternative fuel cars on I-95 HOV with one occupant is giving them a double benefit because the highway is HOV-3. SNIPDoes anyone have any info on other HOVs around the country, what they are doing with hybrids, and whether hybrids are popular elsewhere?

I was under the impression that the clean fuel vehicle HOV exemption in Virginia was prompted by Darryl Issa, a Congressman from California. Someone has infomed me that the exemption was home grown in Virginia on Governor Jim Gilmore's watch.

This may have some credibility as Gilmore was the Governor that fired Dave Gehr.

If you have any details on who was behind allowing SOV clean fuel vehicles on Shirley Highway, please reply to Dick Boyd. [:)]

No good deed should go unpunished. Anonymous

Check out Boyd's Bees ad on Slug-Lines.com classified.

dickboyd@aol.com